Can We Speed Up Browser Evolution?
So I just read the statement from the Mozilla Foundation which predicts 10% of the world’s web browsers will be Mozilla-based by the end of 2005. While some people seem pretty excited about this development, I can’t help but wonder if we are settling for too little here. 15 months? 10%? By comparison, every time a new version of the Flash plug-in is released, we get a predictable 80-90% penetration rate at the 15 month mark. Why can’t we expect this sort of development pace with browsers? Several reasons… some perhaps solvable and some perhaps not. This article will discuss several of the issues involved and recommend possible solutions.
Leadership and control
One of the biggest factors in the upgrade cycle differences between Flash and open source browsers like Mozilla is the lack of absolute control in open source development. When Macromedia sits down every year to plan their budgets and product releases, they need only to decide on an amount of money to invest in Flash development and a feature set. After these two decisions are made, the Flash team has their marching orders and they can begin setting things like release dates and migration strategies. Every member of the Flash team is paid a salary for their full-time dedication to the product over the next several months and since most Macromedia employees are in the same location, workplace synergies help to speed and enhance the development process.
Contrast this to the open source development process of the Mozilla Foundation. Mozilla, like all open source projects, requires the individual contributions of people who, for the most part, butter their bread elsewhere in the internet economy. While there are a handful of people working full-time on the project, a large amount of the contributions are made from people who pitch in after hours, on their own volition. This is the very spirit that makes open source what it is: a distributed group effort aimed at creating public good. While that goal is arguably more honorable than the goal of say, Macromedia, its built-in disadvantages are obvious. As far as I know, there is no single person in the Mozilla Foundation who can push through a feature set without the approval of many others. This is, of course, by design, but again, it carries its own disadvantages. There is also no open-source equivalent to a Macromedia manager awarding bonuses or extra stock grants to employees working overtime for a product launch. Since Mozilla participation is voluntary and only intrinsically rewarding, artificial motivation injection is severely sacrificed.
So you might be saying, “But you’re comparing Flash to a browser… that’s not fair”. Okay, well let’s look at Safari then. Safari took about a year and a half to become arguably the best browser in the world, on any platform. Why? Leadership and control. Dave Hyatt and the small team he worked with at Apple were able to take the little-used open-source KHTML rendering engine and set real objectives for it. Using the famous Steve Jobs mantra of “real artists ship”, Hyatt and his team not only improved the rendering engine itself by leaps and bounds but they built an entire framework for web browsing on OS X called WebKit. And on top of that, Apple’s improvements to KHTML were donated right back to the open-source community for use in other KHTML projects. Why did Apple do this? Because they realized that their strength on the web relies on interoperable, open standards. This is the opposite of Microsoft’s early stance that IE must contain technologies only available to it and not other browsers.
* I want to pause right here and make it clear that nothing in this article is meant as a knock against Mozilla, open source, or anybody involved in either. Firefox — now that it’s on the right track — is clearly the most important product in the browser world today and this article aims only to examine how to help speed its progress and adoption.
Transparency of operation
With each new version of any given browser, observable changes are made to the interface. New menu options are added. A new icon is sometimes designed and placed in a different place on the user’s computer than the old icon. Chrome looks different. Bookmarks are sometimes not carried over correctly. Toolbars and other customizations may be removed. The list goes on and on. Generally speaking, users hate change, and when change is introduced during an upgrade cycle, the first reaction in users is almost always negative. Sure, this feeling may subside once the user begins to appreciate the improvements, but it still creates “upgrade anxiety” as users are afraid of what changes any new browser will bring.
Compare this to a Flash upgrade. Flash is completely transparent to the user. There is no interface. In fact, this is what initially attracted me to Flash 2 back in the mid 90s. When a user upgrades Flash plug-ins, the only noticeable difference is that more robust applications are now available to them. And even then, applications which take advantage of the newest capabilities of Flash only begin trickling in over the next year or so. In other words, there is no shock, and hence there is no anxiety.
Ease of upgrade
Simply put, Flash has set the gold standard for software upgrades via the web. By marching to their own standard and using both the object and embed tags in a smart fashion, new versions of Flash are instantly and transparently available for PC IE users and pretty easily available to the rest of the world as well. A restart is usually not required, no user data is affected, and the size of the upgrade is anywhere from a few hundred kilobytes to about a megabyte in size. Over a broadband connection, the upgrade is usually complete from start-to-finish in a matter of seconds. Over a dialup connection, it may take a few minutes. But the most important aspect of the upgrade is that there is almost no possibility of confusion for the user. It feels more like getting a package in the mail than moving to a new city.
Browsers, on the other hand, are notorious for their difficult upgrade procedures. Now, when I say “difficult”, I don’t mean difficult to you and me. Any power user of web technologies and computer systems can figure out how to upgrade rather easily… and that is part of the reason we are always the first to upgrade. Take your average computer user, however. This is the person who thinks that little blue “e” icon on their desktop labeled “The Internet” actually is the internet. How many times have you heard the phrase “my internet won’t launch” or even from President Bush in the debates, “I hear there’s rumors on the Internets…” The fact is that part of the reason Internet Explorer has a 95% market share right now is that Microsoft has successfully reduced the concept of the internet down to a postage-stamp sized icon on your desktop.
You want to get people using Firefox? You need to do a lot more than just coerce them into clicking a “Download Now” link. You need to educate them on what a browser is and why it’s not a “different internet” but rather a different agent between them and the internet. It’s a tricky proposition because this revelation definitely adds a layer of complexity to a user’s perception of the internet, but at the same time, it’s an important layer to know about. It is an assistive layer, a navigational layer, and most importantly a protective layer. And so, the best way to introduce this layer is to succinctly spell out its advantages, as has been done very nicely on the Browse Happy site.
Isolation of the rendering engine
I separate a browser upgrade into two parts: The interface and the rendering engine. The interface is everything outside the viewport and the rendering engine is everything inside of it. For the most part, the interface is completely localized and does not materially affect the display of web content. It lets you do things like print a page, add a bookmark, or toggle between windows. The rendering engine, however, radically affects the display of web content and is codependent on things like HTML, CSS, and and Javascript in order to do its job. It is this sometimes-symbiotic, sometimes-antibiotic relationship between the rendering engine and the code we develop for it which causes the majority of headaches in web developers’ lives and retards web publishing by years at a time.
As much as I like tabbed browsing, more sophisticated autofill, and better bookmark organization, these are clearly user interface features within the browser itself and I’m happy letting users decide if and when to apply the upgrades which introduce them. But as for the rendering engine, I feel like this is the sort of thing that should be applied automatically every 1-2 years or at least pushed in front of the user in a persuasive yet polite way… a la Flash.
“We’ve noticed your browser needs to be quickly tuned. The necessary components have already been downloaded. Click here to tune-up.”
What got me thinking about this was one day several months ago when I launched my MSN Messenger client and was greeted with the message “Due to security upgrades, you must upgrade your version of MSN Messenger to 4.8 in order to log into the MSN Instant Messenger network”. Wow! As long as this doesn’t happen too often (it’s happened only once to me), it’s a spectacular way to get everyone on the same page. I bet Microsoft was able to upgrade their entire population of MSN IM clients within a month or two since the upgrade was more or less mandatory. Why do we settle for any less in browsers? If we could limit automatic updates to the rendering engine alone, users could scarcely argue that an upgrade was any sort of risk.
Furthermore, if this sort of reliable upgrade cycle started in the 90s, where would we be right now? CSS-7? We’re already at Flash 7. Look at all the progress that has been made between Flash 2 and Flash 7 and apply even 50% of that progress to the browser space. Would it cause more frequent redesign cycles for web sites? Sure. But all that does is create jobs in the industry and it is certainly a legitimate investment in technology. Instead, companies are spending their money producing commercials with sock puppets. Additionally, when HTML and CSS specs are written, they are usually written in such a way which does not infringe on existing sites. Therefore, a company may still wait however many extra years they want before redesigning… they will just be missing out on possible extra site features.
Setting the standards
The specter of automatic, benevolent rendering engine upgrades re-introduces the question of control. If Safari, Mozilla, Opera, and IE are to release upgrades around the same time which introduce roughly the same rendering engine enhancements, clearly one of two things needs to happen:
- The W3C needs to draft a Kyoto Treaty of sorts and convince all major players (currently 4) to apply W3C recommendations to their rendering engines on perhaps a biennial basis. The W3C would draft the specs, the browser makers would have a month or two to discuss it and offer revisions, and then the final spec would be delivered. The spec would never be considered a finished product and thus it would never be committeed to death in the pursuit of perfection. How is this different from what happens today? Easy. There is currently no agreement and there are no hard timelines. We are dealing in recommendations which may or may not manifest themselves at some point in the future and that is why we see such slow progress. If someone asked you right now when you’d expect multi-column text flow to be supported in 90% of browsers, what would you say? I couldn’t even make a guess. If someone asked me when they could expect alpha-maskable Flash video to be viewable by 90% of the population, I could almost tell them the exact month.
- Representatives from the four major players in the browser world could just get together and decide on this stuff themselves. I’m not talking about a room full of people. I’m talking about a tent full of people. Camp David style. If they were smart, they’d expand the group with a Doug Bowman, a Shaun Inman, or other persons of noble repute, but the group would have to stay intimately small to be effective. Additionally, there would be little tolerance for idealism if it impeded speed. XML purists need not apply. The WHATWG is the closest thing I see to this right now. They are a small group self-charged with readying specs for next-generation web applications, and in many cases, they are the exact people I’d want on this board — people with the power to walk into their companies and order immediate product changes.
Some people will look at these two options and wonder if all parties would actually agree to such things. Well, maybe not, but I’m pretty sure 3 out of 4 would agree to some degree of it, and that’s enough to eventually push the 4th into irrelevance or acquiescence. If the recent success of Safari and Firefox has shown us anything, it’s that “open” wins in the long run, and if you aren’t producing what the community wants, the community will eventually not want you.
Backwards compatibility
The bane of the web developer’s existence, in many ways, is backwards-compatibility. It is important, however, to separate the concepts of backwards-compatibility in browsers and backwards-compatibility in code. If Mozilla, Apple, Opera, or Microsoft were to release a new browser, it must clearly be backwards-compatible with existing web sites which use older coding standards or just very poor coding practices. Without this backwards-compatibility, no one would adopt a new browser. Both Mozilla and Opera have struggled with this issue over the past few years, with plenty of sites (well built or not) not displaying properly in them. But now that smart error-tolerances have been built in, Mozilla and Opera are a joy to use. Standards purists will say that new browser versions shouldn’t have to deal with error tolerances and that web developers should just always build error-free sites, and they are right… but they are also ignoring the reality that most web sites will not be 100% standards-compliant for quite some time, if ever. Validation aside, there is other error-correction necessary in browsers related to various CSS quirks and how they affect the display of content on page.
So, backwards-compatibility in browsers is a must, and it will likely always be. But what about backwards-compatibility in code? This is going to make some people mad, but I have to admit that I am not for 100% backwards compatibility in code, in perpetuity. Let’s say I have an audience of 100 people who visit my site. Let’s say if I code and design with method A, it will produce good pages viewable by all 100 people. Now let’s say that if I code and design with method B, it will produce GREAT pages viewable by 99 of the people. The one person who can’t view my pages is maybe clinging to their copy of Netscape 4. How many people would choose method A? I wouldn’t. I’d choose method B, because the aggregate amount of quality I’m producing for my audience is worth losing one audience member over. Now, my example is assuming a 99% success rate. What is the lowest you’d go? Clearly, different people have different thresholds. I think most people would fall squarely in the mid to upper 90s. 97%, 98%, 99%… around that area. So if you’re going to forsake 100% backwards compatibility in code, as I do, the whole goal of increasing the pace of web standards improvement becomes a lot more attainable. After all, as with Flash, it may only take months to reach the 90% penetration rate, but it may take a lifetime to reach 100%.
* In making a decision to drop support for certain user agents, it is obviously important to do your homework first. Different sites call for different practices. For example, an e-commerce site may lose a lot of money if only one customer cannot access the site… whereas an ad-supported site does not share this concern. This is part of the reason why the eBays and Amazons of the world still code the way they do.
In digesting these views on backwards-compatibility, please keep in mind that I am not advocating throwing user accessibility aside in any shape or fashion — only user agent accessibility. What does that mean? If a person cannot see a web page because their vision is impaired, I have sympathy for them. I want to design and code in such a way that helps them. But if a user cannot see a page because they are too unmotivated to stop using Netscape 4, I really don’t have any sympathy for them. A bit of pity, maybe, but definitely not sympathy. In fact, I feel like these people would be better off in the long run if every web site in the world turned them away at the door (as is starting to happen). Now, some people will just say “Build your site in such a way that it degrades gracefully in these sorts of browsers”. To that, I say fine, if your site is heavily text-oriented and stylistically sparse. But if you want to do things on your site which require some of the newer W3C standards and other interactive touches, the reality is that your site just may not degrade very well. Other people will say “Well just serve an unstyled page to these users”. Again, I say fine, but does anyone really enjoy sites with completely unstyled content? If you’re a layout-intense media site, your “unstyled” site is going to look and feel a lot worse than Yahoo’s intentionally sparse site, so the 1% of users who may see your unstyled page are probably better off going to Yahoo.
My point here is that I feel like for most sites, using modern coding standards with perhaps a tad less backwards-compatibility is okay to do. It’s your site. Why let such a tiny percentage of people dictate how you design and code it?
By the way, as a further footnote to this point, I am also not saying it’s ok to say things like “Okay, my audience is 95% PC IE so I’ll just code for that.” That is NOT the message. The message is, “Let’s speed the adoption rate of W3C standards and let’s also speed the rate at which we apply them on our own sites.” If that causes a few more people to upgrade browsers before they’d like to, so be it.
In most cases, you are providing your site to the world completely on your own volition. As much as people would like to believe otherwise, it is not the right of every citizen to be able to view it. If you wanted to, you could write your whole site in gibberish or you could password-protect the entire thing. It doesn’t matter. It’s your right to do so. The notable exception here is government agencies, who are required to provide certain information to all citizens within their region. The other notable exception, of course, is in matters of accessibility. Just as one should not discriminate on race, creed, color, or sex, one should not discriminate on disability. So before anyone comments on that, let’s be clear that when I suggest perhaps ditching some backwards-compatibility, accessibility is not part of what should get ditched. In fact, by adopting new accessibility standards, accessibility should actually be improved. Should we really be using all of these counter-intuitive image replacement techniques? With better standards and faster adoption of said standards, we can ditch the need for these tricks.
Next steps
So what can we do to help radically speed the adoption of better browsers and gradually raise the backwards-compatibility bar? Here are a few suggestions:
- Help spread Firefox to every computer you can get your hands on. I’m talking about your parents’ computers, your coworkers’ computers, computers in public spaces, etc. Don’t just download it. Install it, import everything you can, and place its icon where the old browser’s icon was. Obviously don’t remove any old browsers, but make it as easy as possible for users of said computer to subtly modify their browsing routine so that it goes through Firefox. In cases where education is necessary, take a few minutes to explain why switching is a good thing. Use hyperbole when necessary.
- Design and code your sites specifically with modern web standards in mind. Most of your testing, up through completion of the layout, should be done in standards-compliant browsers like Safari and Firefox, and then you can add whatever hacks you need after that to massage the layout into other browsers. I find these days that the only hack I generally even need is the underscore hack, which is extremely easy to implement.
- If you are faced with a choice between forward-looking code and backward-looking code, choose forward-looking in all cases except where a significant portion of your audience may be alienated. A quick example of this is the Netscape 4 example. If 1% of your audience uses Netscape 4 and designing a Netscape 4-friendly layout creates 30% more work and 30% more code and isn’t as pure as you’d like it, consider ditching Netscape 4 compatibility. Go ahead and serve them an unstyled page if you’d like, but don’t get hung up on how it looks.
- Continue to push the limits of the web and exert pressure on browser makers to continuously improve their products. I am so happy with how far Mozilla and Safari have come in the last couple of years and I’d love to see the momentum continue. Rendering current sites beautifully is a great start. Rendering future sites even more beautifully is the overriding goal. Give us drop-shadows for arbitrary objects. Give us multi-column text flow capabilities. Give us the ability to clear absolutely positioned divs. Without designers and developers clamoring for these improvements, we’ll enter another period of stagnation. Don’t settle for simple text-based bloggish layouts for everything you do. I, along with Shaun Inman, Tomas Jogin, and Mark Wubben, invented sIFR to give people richer, more beautiful typography on the web; but another reason we invented it was to show precisely how silly it is that it’s even necessary. Now that there are sites out there which make beautiful use of it, browser makers and standards bodies have at least a working model of what people are looking for.
- Create the Rapid Browser Improvement Delta Force (or R.B.I.D.F.) I mentioned earlier in the article. I’m serious when I say that I’d rather have a handful of representatives determine actionable browser improvements and then immediate act on them than wait for initiatives work their way through years of committees only to result in hopeful recommendations. Please know that this is not a knock on the incredible amount of thought and effort coming from these committees… it is just a realization that sometimes the more people who are involved in a decision and the more perfect these people try to make that decision, the slower things tend to move. Sometimes you don’t need perfect decisions… you just need helpful, swift ones. If anyone has suggestions for such a panel of people, please post them in the comments. 10 or less people sounds about right to me.
Conclusion
I realize that some of my thoughts on browser development are a bit naive (seeing as I have never developed one myself), but I’ve been in this industry long enough to know that the inability for us to use newer coding standards shortly after they are released is largely self-imposed. We settle for browsers which don’t upgrade their rendering engines transparently, we settle for specifications which take too long to pass through large committees, and we settle for coddling to the 1% of the population who doesn’t see fit to upgrade with the rest of us.
We need to quit settling.
Do your part by helping spread standards-compliant browsers like Firefox, Safari, and (sometimes) Opera to as many computers as possible. With a little bit of help, I think we can obliterate this ultra-conservative 10% prediction by the end of 2005. Don’t stop with browser proselytizing though. Gather usage statistics on your site and plan migration strategies for a move to more modern code. If you reckon you’ll be able to dump support for Browser X in 12 months, begin laying the groundwork right now. And finally, keep pushing the boundaries of web design and development so that the people up in the hills who write stuff into stone know that we’re not going to wait for what’s right when we can have what’s right now. We need to get web publishing back on the fast track, and by rapidly speeding both the evolution and the adoption of modern web standards, we can create an efficiency and innovation boom this medium has never seen.
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One last thing to mention: if you’ve ever trawled through
the thousands of bugs listed on Bugzilla (Mozilla’s bug
database) you’ll realise that it is a major effort
to code a browser. There are so many combinations of layout to
cater for. Different plugins add to this. Then think about
JavaScript and dynamic content using the DOM method. To me
it’s clear why implementing new code takes so long. I too
wish for CSS3, but we haven’t even got 100% CSS2.1 compliance
yet, have we? Because each new part needs to be tested and tested
until it is bug free.
By the way, Olly, in Mac Firefox 1.0 preview release, the
automatic update choice is in preferences, not tools.
3. Glad everyone seems to like the separate of the rendering
engine theory. As someone mentioned, Apple is starting to do this a
bit already, but unfortunately they seem to be tying this to OS
upgrades. Bad.
Mike, you seem to be contradicting yourself (and trying very
hard to paint yourself back out of your corner)
I think one of the best ways to increase the penetration of more
modern browsers would be for ISPs to start including Firefox on
their install CDs. Look at AOL. My dad doesn’t even know how
to use IE because he just logs onto AOL and browses from there. He
is surprised when he sees me on the home computer using Firefox to
go on the internet. Even so when the latest version of AOL comes in
the post it gets installed – there’s no pop-up that
won’t go away like with Flash, but it’s a newer version
so it must be better.
would it be horrible to say safari is not the best browser even
if it did run on multiple platforms?
I believe FF is more up to date on the render engine and displaying
standard compliance code than safari is…
Grass roots education is what is needed here to counter the ever
present F.U.D
I also think your separation of the rendering engine and the
browser is key. I’ve often wondered what the impact would be
if Apple offered a version of Safari for Windows — or even
just the WebKit. I think that the browser will become less
important as the rendering engine itself is implemented into apps
and even operating systems (see iTunes, NetNewsWire, etc.). If
WebKet and Gecko are the best and simplest rendering engines to
integrate into your apps, developers may find that their adoption
will contribute to the irrelevance of IE.
Why should one give oneself with 10% contently?
The problem is in part that Apple provides too many changes and
KDE has too few resources to deal with them. There is no question
that Apple could do more (fund the Konqeror project, donate money,
provide patches), but they do follow the license and that is really
the most important thing.
»Nicht weil es schwer ist, wagen wir es
nicht,
sondern weil wir es nicht wagen, ist es
schwer.«
You mention the example of Yahoo. If they want to render
acceptably in Netscape 4, that is their choice. And the reason why
no-one should advocate the deliberate blocking of particular
browsers on nothing more than a whim.
Unfortunately, the various judicial rulings never got beyond the
level of “should the browser as a whole be in the OS or
not”.
Another example, I think rotary phones are still out there, but
folks with rotary phones cannot expect (or demand the right) to be
able to navigate the automated voice menu systems. Maybe
there’s alternative phone numbers or methods out there which
they can employ, but if they are available, they are usually not
obvious or as simple as the touch-tone route.
An interesting announcement by an IE7 developer
sheds some light on the next big browser we’ll need to
support. Most of what I read here is good news but I am a bit
disappointed with the fact IE7 will be wound so tightly into only
the new Vista OS. It would have been better if Win2k, XP (early
service packs) would be able to download the browser when
it’s released. Now it will take a few extra years at least to
weed out IE6 since many people like myself have been happy with
Win2k as a development platform. I have no idea if IE7 will be able
to port to Mac but I doubt it
For a start, I’d have you on the Delta Force commitee. You
talk a lot of sense. I’m new to this design thing and
I’m still learning all the little tricks to make the stuff I
do IE freindly. It annoys me that I can design something
that’ll validate for CSS and XHTML first time, and yet not
work in IE. Why should I have have to write garbage to get my sites
to work in the browser that 80 odd 90% of the world uses?
My worry is that Microsoft will never sit down on your “Delta
Force Commitee” and therefore render it a bit meaningless.
Like it or not Microsoft do currently rule the roost in terms of
user base.
The fact that the Box Model Hack and the Underscore hack and the
plethora of other little hacks exist at all says to me that the
biggest browser company in the world could care less about the new
web standards. If they don’t care, then the rest of us are
screwed for a while to come.
Hopefully, enough people will start to use standards complient
browsers and Microsoft will stand up and take notice….
Can We Speed Up Browser Evolution?…
I don’t have an answer to that.
So Firefox 1.0 finally made its way out today. On a day of many
anticipated releases, as today is also judgment day for the Xbox as
the much anticipated Halo 2 comes out. But back to Firefox.
It’s nice to see that finally a significantly better
product…
It’s just a shame they’re pre-empting MS’
mistake of tying the render engine version to the OS
version…
to stretch the analogy to breaking point, though: extinction
happens naturally – just as, one at a time, users with older
browsers may or may not upgrade because they may or may not
“enjoy” content without presentational bells and
whistles. explicitly blocking user agents is more akin to an
intervention of a higher entity (god or whatever) wilfully (and by
design) making living conditions impossible for a particular older
species. let nature run its course = don’t block user
agents.
Figure 1 There’s a computer disease that not a lot of
people recognize as disease (yet). Technically, it’s not a
virus. However, it does make your computer more vulnerable to
computer viruses, spyware and other bad things. How to
recognize…
Don’t support older browser – but don’t
wilfully stand in their way to accessing your content (styled or
unstyled). No one even won a customer by arguing with them.
Websites optimised to argue with visitors have no long term
future.
80-90% of Flash at the 15 month mark is entirely accurate.
with regards to the first part: it’s not a question of who
really “enjoys” sites which are completely unstyled,
but that – depending on the specific user’s situation
(e.g. they may only have access to an old battered Pentium I on a
slow connection, running Windows 95, with Netscape 4.7 running
because they can’t afford anything else) – it’s
not just a matter of stubborn luddite refusal to upgrade. for these
users, who may or may not be disabled as well, what’s better?
at least making the pure content accessible to them, or simply
shutting the door on them, as you so gleefully suggest? the whole
idea of graceful degradation is such a cornerstone of the W3C
specs, that i can’t really see how you can defend foregoing
any care or thought for it. and no, we’re not talking about
making amends to your css/xhtml so that something
displays right in old browsers, but merely not
just shutting users out based on their browser choice. if their
visual experience is not perfect, but they can at
the very least access the content, then that’s all that
matters – and that falls under accessibility
just as much.
Great idea Mike, however why not take it even further by having
one universal rendering engine?
So, though you can’t expect for disabled users to change
their browser, you CAN, even must for NN4
users.
The only possible solution is a browser based on Flash. I keep
waiting for this miracle to happen. (Use any font! Today! Scalable
layouts to fit all screens!) Macromedia have already taken Flash
way beyond a mere vector display routine – just look at how
it can interact with XML and MP3 files now.
Mike Davidson: Can We Speed Up Browser Evolution? – A good
article on the state of the browser and standards wars.
I just upgraded to Mozilla Firefox 1.0 RC2 (I was on RC 1
before). I think it took about 7 mouseclicks to get it
installed.
macromedia is geared toward us geek developers whom they know is
going to buy their stuff. That’s why their stuff increases so
fast. Plus, the plugin pop-up has probably annoyed more folks than
it should have, so the average user probably go tired of seeing it
and just decided to install Flash…that was before people
really knew what spyware was etc….
if folks saw a flash plugin pop-up screen for the first time today
(meaning if flash just came out today) they’d probably be
like “Ah spyware spyware, don’t download it!)
Now that everyone can trust flash and considering the average
person has heard of it at least once or twice in their lifetime,
they have no tiffs performing the upgrade….plus it takes like
2 seconds…
The only real issue are screenreaders: They (as far as I know)
all use IE, because IE is omnipresent. So that pulls NN4 out of the
equation. Although, if you can bring up examples of screenreaders
that are still in widespread use.
There is no contradiction and there is no corner to back oneself
out of. I said that if you’d like to serve unstyled content,
go ahead. There is nothing wrong with that. There is also, however,
nothing wrong with having a stricter policy on who gets in, as long
as that policy is not based on a protected class like race, creed,
disability, etc. “Netscape 4 users” are not a
protected class, nor should they be. Nothing about them implies
disability… in fact, I’d be willing to bet that for
disabled users, that browser actually hurts things more than it
helps. My argument does not preclude serving unstyled content to
users… do it if you wish. But in the end, it is your
site and you may do otherwise if you choose. My only point in this
regard is that as long as you aren’t violating any laws, your
user-agent policy is your choice.
but yes, my main point here: users with disabilities use the
same kind of browsers “normal” people use.
Where did you get this information from?
Firefox is growing fast: Why are we predicting small
numbers?
the answer is: yes, of course it does. notice the “Or if
you’d like to view ESPN’s lite site for older browsers
and WebTV, click here.” link when you access the main ESPN
site via NN4.x. as vinnie mentions above, this is ok-ish…but
outright blocking (which, even if mike didn’t necessarily
advocate as the only solution, some readers like yourself here have
obviously picked up) isn’t.
Your average user believes the application is the interface and
only understands a browser upgrade in terms of interface
improvements. It’s not until you start to use more than one
browser that you learn that web pages are interpreted, not
just viewed.
The answer I get when asking why folks keep using IE is:
»Duh, it works just
fine.« And I think that’s another
problem that webdevelopers themselves create: there are a lot of
sites out there using JavaScripts, table layouts and lots of ugly
stuff just so IE renders their site correctly (to do
hover:anything, for instance). Why? Nobody does that for NN4
anymore (or do they?), but because IE still has a high marketshare
everyone
»optimizes« for it
and the user doesn’t even notice that he or she is using an
obsolete browser. And IE keeps its marketshare. It’s a
viscious circle, really.
Imagine a world where websites rendered *exactly* the same on
every OS and browser because the rendering engine was the same!
I’ve always been hesitant to upgrade to each new FireFox
release because it breaks my extensions and even my
themes. We need to stop telling people why they need to
make the effort to upgrade and just remove the need for user
effort.
Ideally, at least the first two services would be replaceable by
any vendor’s implementation (and even more ideally, a power
user would be able to to switch back and forth between different
implementations, perhaps on both a vendor and version basis). A Web
browser would make use of all three services, providing a user
interface for browsing. A web services client could use just the
HTTP client service. Everyday application could implement its
interface using HTML and just use the rendering service.
I’m sorry, but accessibility, for me, is about making
things available to the widest possible audience, accommodating a
spectrum of ability. Your NN4 users may be a minority, but
it’s likely that so are your users who are colour-blind. You
try not to exclude people who have such visual impairments though,
so why exclude browsers with a “disability”?
And that page doesn’t let NN4 users get to the content
does it?
Just curious: What do you think is a reasonable percentage to
shoot for at the end of the 15-month period?
1. With regards to Safari being “arguably the best browser
on any platform” — there is a reason I put the word
“arguably” in there. It’s personal preference and
I’m not saying one way or the other if I personally think
it’s best. And besides, that’s really not the point of
this post. It doesn’t matter whether Safari, Firefox, or
Opera is the best… it just matters that together, they are
clearly the best. The focus should be on getting everyone we know
to use one of the three.
Patrick: You asked “Why have a user agent policy at
all?” Simple. Education. When we started redirecting ESPN
Netscape 4 users to a browser upgrade page about a year and a half
ago, we were responsible for a huge batch of people upgrading their
browsers. The fact is that with some users, the only way
to get them to upgrade is to create an undeniable need. We felt
honored to create this need and many users have thanked us for
helping them see the light. If you don’t believe in such a
policy for your own site, great… don’t have one. The
attitude that somehow everyone’s policy must be the same as
yours is one I don’t understand.
Oh, lastly I have found two ofbest things to help get non-tech
ie users to go to FF… find as you type, and the
dictionarysearch extension…
Dan J, if you ever check this page again, I have used FireFox a
lot lately and I know what you mean about it being slow. But mostly
this is just the overhead from the software loading. Once FF loads
you can browse around with no problems and some pages seem to load
much faster then IE for me. I notice IE lags when there is a large
amount of content with many positioned boxes. Don’t forget IE
loads extra fast because of the way MS has it integrated into the
OS. Some of the resources it needs are loaded at startup. The trade
off for such seemingly fast loading MS software is a nice long wait
for the system to boot up!
I know there are companies that standardise on NN4, but in that
case the IT department has more than enough choice and if enough
people complain they’ll update (even if it’s to IE,
it’s still better).
Anyways, I’ve rambled on enough… As mentioned, we
should install it on any machine we see. Once 1.0 comes out, I know
I will be.
A CD in the post from your ISP with a (possibly brand-themed)
install of Firefox and packing which encourages users to upgrade to
a new client and touts some simple new features (faster browsing!
more secure! prettier interface!) would win many converts. Users
aren’t adverse to new features and better ways of using
computers, they’re simply clueless as to what is possible and
how to get it.
Regarding the main article here, it was well written. But the
main problem is always IE6. Even if a group of
browser makers got together (as you suggest) do you really think
Microsoft would be willing to upgrade their browser as fast as
Mozilla would? They are only interested in selling Longhorn.